Programmed Drums vs Real Drums - The Ultimate Test!

I record out of my basement and have a real drummer send me drums he plays on a e-kit that turns his parts into midi. Gives them a real feel. I then use drum plugs and samples to make it sound like the kit I want, bounce it down and mix it. Good hybrid solution for me!

Im drummer and keyboardist, Since I dont own a drum kit I do all my drum parts with Superior Drummer 2. When ppl approach me to record a song or something they always ask who played the drums and how I recorded it. They never know is programmed drums. Something I do really different from other ppl is I dont quantize the track. Just good timing you know like a real drummer would do. Only fix in editing the obvious parts that sounds really out of timing. I used to quantize the drums years ago but stop and since thats when ppl started thinking it was a real drummer . I remember when EZ drummer came out a lot of ppl was saying is cheating LOL . If you think about it the convenience you get is that someone already recorded a very well tuned drum kit and passed it to you. The only difference is now you have the option of lets say .."make the drum parts be as you really imagine in your head." Theres no AI drumming for you. Would you rather have a very well recording of a very expensive Ludwig kit thru a API , SSL or Neve console or some mediocre bad tuning old skins Tama RockStar kit thru a Mackie console? Cuz lets face it...thats what some ppl give us to mix sometimes 😂 and since I really not sure where it was recorded and all he process .....im pretty good with SD🤷🏻

Ha, the low end on SD or whatever your using has a better tighter low end on those kicks then the mic mix, imho
Less mush below 70hz

Old mix sound much more pleasing.🤔

You've done a very, very good job... but even if there might have been no ambient room recording or live tracks recorded with a bit of natural room bleed done in your original, I don't know, maybe it could have all been close mic-ed and each tracked done separately...either way, somehow the first one has a depth and size to it...almost as if it has space the depth of field that natural ambiance creates...that place or dimension we can close our eyes and almost spiritually escape to... ..whereas the second sounds more flat across the speakers, less depth of field, much smaller, more two dimensional and less open sounding. I know one can add room ambiance with fx but it never seems quite the same. I'm retired after working 47 years, my sole, lifetime career, in studio production and towards the end i'd gotten to the point I didn't care to record anything...except maybe a vocal track, with mic within 4' of whatever instrument of sound being recorded. I think working with midi from about 1983 until ITB / plugins somehow gave my a real love and appreciation for live tracking in a room as well as using analog hardware rather than plugins.

May just be a bit of dementia taking hold in older age but I perceive the spirit...or the essence of music... is being restricted... and the life of the actual living spirit of music itself, is being choked out of it somehow in the digital realm. Everyone may laugh but I do not feel edified or spiritually fed in the way some music is able to bring to our lives... My two cents withstanding, you've done an excellent job in both.

I think that because of the fact that metal is a very technical kind of music, when even real drums sounds very mechanical and technical and proccesed in a very compressed and hard way, there's might almost be no difference between real drums and midi drums. But- i actually really liked the real version, not necessarily because of the sound, but because of the feel.
Another solution is recording real drums and use triggers, good compromise to my opinion

My opinion is that nowadays midi drums are closer to real drums in big albums, but for the wrong reason. I believe most real drums are so overprocessed that they already sound like midi. Just listen to whatever Nuclear Blast is releasing or anything done by Jens Bogren, everything sounds the same. For example, the last Michael Romeo albums, they all sound absolutely midi and programmed, but it's a real drummer. But then go and listen to the album "V" by Symphony X, that's a lovely real metal drum sound.

I struggle with this myself the main thing I find is the high hats just don't sound right especially on open patterns for they always sound bish bashy they just don't sing like a real drummer *

IM humble O, The programmed drums do what any other plug in does. Its very transparent - hey these are not real drums,but we will give you all these XYZ options to tweak. And more you tweak ( listen) you start convincing yourself how it gets better and better blah blah. What would you do if you have a guitar take that its not what you want? Delete it and re-record. So if you are looking for a real drum sound -get real drum. I can see MIDI drums being popular in metal ,because its popular in pop music. And there is a big connection with pop and metal ( choruses of the songs)for last 20 years.

i like the drum presset you can put to shell or share ? :)

Programmed drums sound especially shit against softer sections of songs imo. Heavier sections, they can normally skate by, but as soon as you start actually listening, they fall apart.

What song?

What song?

"Round"...is what is missing from digital drum sounds. Your vid does a good job of showing it in the tracks comparison part.

wow those velocities for the drum midi are almost totally maxed out, I was always taught to save 120-127 for the hardest hitting section and back off for the rest

Honestly it just sounds like a different mix. The digitalis sounds cleaner and more crisp. The origonal.sounds more powerful and full.. you could fool me on which is which.

Most MIDI drums are samples of actual recorded drums.
The problem is every hit is the exact same and timing is flawless. Which leaves a very dry and fake sound ing drum track. If you make hit every other hit a little different and add a more human aspect to the timing, it might sound really good

The real drums, especially the cymbals, sound richer and brighter. The midi programmed drums sound dull, darker, maybe you can say flat;however, they can probably be used in particular metal music genres.

I just wanna be able to produce somewhat decent demos of the songs I write at home. Maybe some day I'll decide to really become a producer, but that's not currently my ambition. Thanks for these videos though, much appreciated!

How do I move drums from midi to actual audio like you said?

How I see it, or hear it, what you're doing is like selecting the best T.V.. Unless you have a wall of T.V.'s with the same settings to compare, you really wouldn't know. Since you had a comparison, I liked the sound of the first mix. The Sample mix sounds really dull and robotic as well as over compressed and processed. But I'm old school and like the raw/open sound. You know.... Where it took actual talent to record as a live take with minimal chopping of the tape. Digital made it easier, yes. Easier isn't always better.

Not my genre of music at all, but the original to my ears had a far more prominent drum presence. Hmm, not so noticeable in the quieter sections.

I use programmed drums all the time. I spend quite a bit of time modifying the velocity of each note and shifting the timing slightly to make it sound less robotic. Then I remove all the EQ and compression built in to the VST and export the tracks individually, and work with those dry audio tracks to mix them like recorded drums like you mentioned. Now, my mixing skills aren't the best, but it's much better working this way than to just mix with the MIDI drums playing from a single VST because you can work with EQs and compressors you're familiar with, not these specialized ones that are only ever used with the VST.

Actually studying real drums from music you like is so important to understand how to write drum parts and learning the articulations that make them sound human.

amazinggggg

Looks like Jordan is using Waves GTR for those guitars... How do you make THAT one sound so good?

you can even go with real overheads & room and replace close mics. I’ve had good results with that too. country AND western 🤩👍🏼

Can you get Digital Production Blueprint these days? Or still not available? I'd love to watch it.

🤔I’m a drummer. And… ya know fake digital drumming NEVER did anything for me. I have an extremely sharp ear. And I even had your samples playing on my surround sound setup in my living room. Yeah man… to me hands down the natural drums just have more texture and punch.

I also don’t like drum edits both digital and natural alike where we edit OUT all human imperfections. To me that is the beautiful thing about art. A perfect drummer that sounds perfect 100% of the time as far as on beat laser straight robot is just soulless. Drummers are not robots.

I loathe fake digital drums. And absolutely despise how people are just so casually erasing our human imprint which is the heartbeat of the entire song dare I say FOUNDATION of it. With basically an Ai of sorts.

If I’d ever go digital it would have to be with a nice physical set that’s relatively expensive because a handful of those did impress me.

But the whole copy paste feel on a program not only rubs me the wrong way. It just sounds cold and dead. And not in a good way. In a fabricated insulting emulated way.

That’s my opinion.

I think if you’re a solo artist or simply can’t play/afford/ or move drums in to your living space I can understand. And I do believe for now it’s kind of a eh get the job done level of quality with most programs.

But it just tweaks my nerves when people play it off like it’s the same. It is absolutely NOT the same. It’s insulting to drummers who took multiple years to perfect their craft. And it rips the human interaction right out of the song. Less authentic.

FOR NOW I don’t think it’s good enough to replace real drums. In 10 more years maybe. I just don’t feel it’s there yet. And people need to stop acting like it is.

If you are a believer in the sense that you think it’s a good replacement I think it’s just sad. Cuz idk how TF you don’t hear what I hear. Cuz I hear shit 😆

Man I love your videos thank you

What band/song is it that is playing?

I found that using anyone of the "clean kits" in Superior Drummer 3 (just add a few extra microphones like "Mid amb" and "rear width", and route them multiout to your DAW, then add a ton of tape saturation and it will give you great sounding drums. Then I filter, eq, gate, limit and fader balance in my DAW mixconsole (i use Cubase 12 pro) and it has the perfect channelstrip for this, so no need for plugins.

From the list of producers, composers having those issues, I myself do prefer the live Human touch to say. I am a guitarist and am now looking into getting a Electronic drum Kit. So that will take care of the authentic feel. My current issue is for the best bang for my buck which digital drum machine for my DAW will be best? So I am searching and landed on your video here. Thanx for the experience advice you gave!

Live drum is bae bro

I actually completely disagree. I think the old mix is much less sterile. I strongly prefer the old mix.

The overheads sound so good on real drum recordings, the drums make your head bob - not so with programmed drums. That's the reason I don't like most of the new metal bands - digital sounds & over-editing.

If it grooves, it grooves!

You scared the CRAP out of me! BLAHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!!

To me the thing that gives it away are ride and crash cymbals. Big washy crashes especially sound like a continuous sound when you ride on it in real life, and in midi it sounds like a bunch of completely discrete hits chained together. Also marching snare type parts don't get the right ratio of snare sizzle to top hit in programmed drum suites in my experience. I haven't used the latest gen superior drummer tho.

I a/b'd the Old vs New on Studio Monitors, AT m50x cans, even Bose earbuds. The Old mix sounds tighter, warmer. New mix sounds wider, stereophonic, clearer, open. But the Old version sounds more cohesive, professional. Imo

I would like to also add that a better idea is to not program drums from start and use the midi grooves from Superior that have been played by real drummers... find the closest one that what you want and edit the rhythm. That way you get real velocities in there.

I think we do not have an issue with Kick, Snare and Toms. The problem is always on Cymbals (crash, hihat, etc). The micro dynamics from a live drummer are very noticeable to the expert ear. To the general public? nah. They can even listen to one dynamic and they'll be fine haha. But it's not about the public, it's about the artist's vision. Anyways... my favorite is usually a blend if budget allows.

the digital guitars don't touch the analog ones for me

Has anyone taken this course?

Have you released this course??

this unhuman crap will come to an end. I´ll give it 3 Years. Good modules with real drummers will take the place

Why don't you use the snare and kick from superior drummer? Don't they emulate different hits better?

You obviously did a great job on the programmed, but during the clean section it didn’t even sound like the same part. I know there’s articulation on these drum plugins, but you would have to sit there for years like Steven hawking doing calculus just to create the real articulation