How many viable playstyles ACTUALLY exist in CLASSLESS WoW? | Project Ascension League 3 |

Just a quick video with some thoughts on the viability of all of the legendary enchants on Ascension today. Will be doing more progression soon. Hope you guys enjoy!

edit: Oh, also the takeaway from this video is that there are an ENORMOUS amount of useless enchants - don't hyper focus on the semantics of whether or not you'd personally put a spec in one category over another - that's just a trap. Focus on the fact that there are literally five, six, or even seven dozen legendary enchants in game that are 100% not useable. I changed the thumbnail slightly to reflect the focus since so many people got got on accident in the comments.

Hard to imagine Molten Earth not being viable, since I saw one just 2 days ago in a mythic dungeon rolling 10k dps in UBRS (which made my 5-targets capped Thunder Slammer green with envy... or rather normally green since she's an orc lady).
All your big damage sources are basically uncapped AOE. But yeah, there are caveats that, if not taken into consideration, you're an absolute mess. Since your damage requires you to place AoE on the ground, you'll want tank to pull half the dungeon, then dps them all down at the boss, rinse and repeat. It requires like 3-4 GCDs to start rolling absurd numbers, and can only roll them when stationary.... and an easy dungeon without mythic+ bullshit mechanics. Just pure spank.

A LOT of enchants have been reworked. Would be nice to see an updated list

Could you make another one of these for the new season? Would love to hear your take on pvp/pve Legendary RE's again..

Just uninstalled the game. You are overcharged (game tokens/gold) to change talents and builds ( something that should be totally free). I got so bugged I was left with no abilities to play after 5 or 6 resets and rebuilds! This is a fraud in the sense that they make you believe that this is classeless and easy. Nooooo, anything but easy.

Retail WoW does not have anything close to 23 unique classes. The vast majority play and feel very similar. If our criteria for "unique" is that the abilities look differently with very minor mechanical differences then really there are thousands of viable builds. Does 1 skill make the difference?

Ascension devs:
"We're gunna pretend we didn't hear that"

there are some legend enchants for leveling broo.... resolute mode... forexample... not everybody just run 2 hour for 1 to 70.... (i hate xp rate destroys the game... the game world is empty ... everybody farm xp in dungeons...

PVP please? ;D

I feel as though you overlooked "Booming Thunder"

As someone who used this enchant when they hit max level and had hardly any gear to start running heroics, I do think it had it's purpose. The synergy isn't there unless you have certain rare and epic enchants to back it up however, but all in all it goes well with a lightning chicken build quite well. If you're spamming Chain Lightning the stacks build up pretty quickly and seeing HUGE Earth Shock crits when you have poopy gear is always a big plus in my opinion. I've since then moved onto "Seething Flames" as my Legendary for dps because I feel it has WAY more aoe potential and the single target isn't all that bad either, but I had to give a shout out to the Legendary that helped me get started at max level on Ascension :D

actually fury warriors where trash for majority of vanilla wow. arms was the only good one untill AQ. and shadow priests where dps to although less common

Honestly if the goal is just to get all the enchants in line with one another, it would be easier to nerf the 12 viable ones than buff 70 non viable ones.

Sorry, I don't buy there that many "viable" and actually play different specs in live.

I really wish Ascension would play more like a Diablo game.

Late to comment. Righteous flames is 3.5 - 4k dps average gear. Better aoe than single target but it's not the worst.

This was an interesting video hearing opinions on LREs. Much better than asking world chat. If it's something you're interested in, I would like to see a video or videos going over how to make weaker specs more viable. Mainly want to see the sort of thought process that goes into doing that, because I would like to see some other perspectives on some off meta setups/gimmicks/ideas that isn't the average player's standard "it doesn't do 9999k DPS so its literal garbage" mindset

Thanks for putting the LREs in perspective and you have an interesting perspective on the matter. This is an good starting point to parse out the LREs if I wanted to make a character to push high mythic keys or ascended raiding.

However, based off trying some of these LREs and what’s mentioned in the comments, it seems like the LREs you mentioned as being “viable” are more so just the easiest to build and play with the biggest DPS payoff. Definitely agree a lot of them are wonky at best that need a lot more support but I think there are more that could work with a lot of time/effort/skill.

How on earth can u say Holy Radiance isnt viable? it's one of the best HPS specs in both dungeon and raids i'd say. Great ST healing, insane AoE healing, consistent healing, solo heal capable in raids etc.

What si a caveat????

Mc double forbidden tech is OP, 22kdps kara hc

where is the list of that 12? Please

I will say one thing which is that Retail has WAYYY more data to look at. You can glance at incredibly accessible websites and see exactly with hundreds of thousands of data points what each class needs to succeed and exactly what abilities those classes have.... And Blizzard still doesnt balance them well.

The Classless devs have way more on their plate to deal with and absolute 0 data to look at so. Do I want them to make balancing, improving, and defining playstyles a priority? Of course. But they have way more to do with way less at their hands to get started so. I gotta cut them some slack atm.

Honestly I just crack out fireball and flamestrike, and pump out some okay single target, and some pretty good AOE, and I'm sure I would have higher if I didn't have a self need to make pets work with the build

Mana Fiend had a niche "Bard" build where people would stack every single Int buff and Spellpower conversion talent and RE physically possible, pop Mana Fiend, and get their demon to crit right at the end of its buff to proc Demonic Pact and give the entire raid like 3k spellpower on A52. It was so good that the Devs absolutely nuked both it and the talent from orbit, despite only the absolute tip of the top of guilds even using the damn build.

Yeah man english is one of the most bloated languages on the planet. Don't worry about pronouncing unless it matters to you. Long as folks get the point that you are communicating that is the goal.
After finishing the video, I agree, there is so much there with most of it being not good, new players get overwealmed have a low chance of picking a good build and end up quitting, unless they find someone that can guide them.

Well I'm glad I watched this, cause I was pumped to jump in but since 90% is "not viable" I will not even spend time on this game. Good video lol....

I really wanted to play on ascension because the promise of freedom to create whatever you wanted looked pretty cool but ofc a small minority of incredibly sad, hugless virgin beta nerds had to figure out "THE BEST" and I guess you're locked to 12 legendaries now. How sad. Sure a lot of them are fucking garbage and outdated but a lot of them could still offer interesting and fun playstyles. These kinds of people always opt to optimize the fun out of everything, so instead of Ascension being a playground you go to to create your own thing you just go "ascension wow top 10 builds" and play whatever the fugg is the current meta just like retail.

It beats everyone playing explosive shot simulator but the new-ish enchants are starting to feel more like glorified classes. Which i would be fine with if they weren't completely overturned compared to the vast vast vast vaaaaaaaaaaast majority of legendary REs, which in turn cranks up the gatekeeping and i honestly cba anymore.

Kinda depressing, meh, i don't know. At this point i almost rather just wait for CoA or go back to retail (puke).

Controlled Burn is disgusting, I just hit 70 with basically no gear and I'm consistently pulling 6-7k single target. With gear it could easily push 10k+

I still hate how little cat form legendary enchants there are

I feel like this only applies to people who want to play hardcore and go for leaderboards, you can do all the content with most builds and a good team.

hate how unnessisarily complicated everything is, came here to look for simple builds and he just goes thru all the enchants i dont know what does and says yes or no, IK you can read it obv and its not his fault its like that but every enchant feels like a 200 years league of legends champion i gotta read a fuckin essay to know wtf it does lol

fingers of death (64ilvl) - STdps(4-5k), AOEdps(5k+) not viable? ok ok

Could you please make a video with good hunter builds/combinations? Because currently hunter seems very off meta. I tried to make hunter good, however it was extremely hard to make it work ..

I talked to Kaladin a couple years ago about a similar topic. He said that their goal to solving build variety and troublesome talent interactions was to encapsulate them into legendary REs. This way they can isolate the balance issue without touching the talents themselves. I'm still waiting to see the supposed strength of this solution. Because eventually the number of legendary REs and even epic REs will become so numerous as you try to accommodate player's playstyle desires, that you've delayed the problem that you were going to run into eventually being a classless MMO.

My suggestion was to just allow these 'broken' talent interactions back into the game and continue iterating along that path. Allow true creative freedom for the player, and for things truly broken you can almost create the inverse of a legendary RE, for specific truly broken builds or interactions you can encapsulate that into an 're' and nerf that interaction selectively. So people can't solo clear BT in fresh 70 blues spamming 300k moonfires for almost no mana, if players have discovered to do that.

how you gonna say hot hands not viable when its pumping so hard in all pve content lol

I lead naxx 25 asc raid every week on Al'ar and have couple of RFs in S6 and S7. Theres a lot of errors in this video.

Viable specs (*does over 10k on Al'ar in naxx right now, A and S tier)

Primordial
Compoud (if 9 rares highroll)
Consumed by Fire*
Hot Hands
MoS*
Controlled Burn*
Fingers of Death*
Demolisher!!
Frozen Chaos
Tools of War (SMF)*
Ambidex (in TBC /w axes)
Ice Lash
Twilight Paragon
Deadly Bite
Righteus Flames*

Funny thing is some of the specs deemed unviable are the best performing spec RN lie MoShadow, ToWar SMF, Righ. Flamers, or are viable on Mal'Ganis bc TBC spells like Fingers of Death.

Maaaany specs can be made viable for RF raiding and M+ farm. Issue is u need about 10 failed specs worth of XP and about 10 hrs of dummy testing and experimenting.

Point being-If u like a spec, make it work, u'll be surprised!

To this day, me and my friends call that rogue spec Sub-tele-ty. As English isn't our first language, we just spelled what we read.

I realize that you had to cover a pretty significant amount of enchants in a short video but I'd love to hear your in-depth reasoning for most of these.
I am pretty new to the server and am not that well-versed with the meta, so any advice is welcome.

Personally, I run with an Ambidextrous build but with Sudden Death Execute instead of Heroic Strike and at 103 ilvl I manage to pull 3K dps ST in dungeons, which I've been told is a decent amount (though I will admit the AoE is a bit lacking). I've also seen videos of Opto pulling 11k with a similar build, which does seem like a good amount as well. So I am a bit surprised that your verdict is that Ambidextrous is not viable and would like to know more.

While every single spec in current retail wow is "viable," you still get declined for keys if you're not running a meta build, unless your IO ranking is ridiculously high. "What's that? You're playing Demonology? How about you switch to Destro, then we can talk?"

Legendary enchants shouldn’t be as complex as they are now. Change or buff one, maybe two abilities; not decide the entire play style for you. And if your build idea isn’t supported by a legendary, you can forget about playing it. My beloved unholy DK just can’t exist on ascension with the current system. It’s really sad.

Imagine actually thinking you're good enough to determine if the LRE's are viable or not.

Sure there's plenty of non-viable LRE's but you've listed so many LRE's and said theyre not viable you're basically telling people that basically nothing is viable lol. Do we even play the same game?

I tried to make a bleed warrior/rogue with ambidextrous 1500csingle target and no aoe :(

I agree 100% alot of the "Legendary" Enchants do not feel very Legendary at all. Feels like the Devs don't really care or they are too lazy to address. Besides Classless, isn't this part of what makes Ascension special? The other disappointing point is Prophet of the Wrath is the only viable LRE available on Area 52. Thunder Slam, no. Wind Rager, no. Lava Sweep, no. Snowblind, no.

Cauterizing Flames is nice for prestiging in BGs and sticking to group fights. Worse damage but better healing than Flame On! (which is what I used) It's not viable for anything else but it's something. Predator's Wrath also fun to lvl BG with and B- tier at max pvp. Oh yeah and chat tells you how words are pronounced because we care, not hate :). They're here ain't they?

Drain heal tank? That build was cool asf and would love to see it again!!

Ascension removed Thunder Slam. So reduce the number of viable builds by one.

Cauterizing flame is healing though