How Ignition Timing ACTUALLY Works, ya idiots

Often, tutorials over simplify ignition timing to the point that its lead to an overall lack of understanding of how it works. for me, understanding what a system is trying to do is often my own deliverance in having a strong command of how to interface with that system. okay, so less engineer words here - if you understand how something works, you are much more effective in tuning it to peak performance.
Edit: one thing I forgot to mention - when you go up in altitude, atmospheric pressure drops, so ignition timing has to increase for all things equal at sea level.
Progression Ignition distributors don’t a stupendous job of handling this on the fly.

I need help I push the gas it falls it face

Hi Luke i just wanted to say ive had two carburetor fires. I have a F100 360 with a Eddlebrock. Its a manual. No mechanic can figure it out and i spent tons of money on mechanics. I would ship it to you because i just want to figure this out😢

WRONG

Yup, that's correct.

Good man….

What's the outro song called?

Thunderhead289 I would like to hear your thoughts on the FE rocker arm oil restrictors. Should we use them or not? I know the FE engines have oiling problem because of the oil being pumped out of the oil pan to fast to the rocker arms. That was a major problem with the 390GT engine back in the day. I did a test with a drill on the oil pump shaft and I could pump the pan down below the screen in about 30 seconds on a 428 SCJ engine. I bought this engine as a rebuilt engine. Ended up rebuilding it again with boring it .30 over. I got stung on that buy. Lol.

I have a chevy small block engine with small cam. Got it set to 800 rpm at idle. Advanced settings to 35 at tdc and 12 degrees idle at tdc. I used pressure vacuum gauge and the best reading I could get is 14. I was hoping to get it up to 16.Truck runs alot better than when I bought it. Im learning everything about cars from watching your videos and has hoping for suggestions.

Hey Luke, been watching you for awhile now and have a question for you Sir.. I’m amazed in that I’ve been working on a Chevy C10 with a 383 Small Block. Initially guy I’d bought it from had vacuum advance disconnected. I re-enabled it. Ran better afterwards and better when re-timed. Then I had slight spark knock, and here is the strange thing which happened.. “Before getting the timing correct, I lessened the exhaust back pressure by going to larger diameter exhaust pipe, then here is the thing… The spark knock which was in engine went away with less back pressure in exhaust. This showing dynamics you had mentioned here?

Proof of your statements given I’d say, very cool Sir!

Question : and for example here..
“Less exhaust back pressure eliminated this particular engine detonation or “knock?”

Cool😊

Great job. Thank you

Hey Luke, i have 1st gen 350 with a edelbrock e street top end kit with 315hp at 9.1 compression. What should my total timing be at and initial timing be? If im doing it right with the vacuum advance removed from the distributer and plug its running at 14 degrees initial and 28 degrees @ 2000-2500 rpm thanks.

More timing means earlier timing?

Ever since I saw him on junkyard digs I love this guy wish had teachers like that lol

All this information from a man wearing a severely bent peaked baseball cap indoors. Now that's a look only an ' idiot ' would adopt.

Vacuum works instantaneously, giving fast advance, working together with the acceleration pump squirts (carb side). As one throttles up to WOT, the vacuum advance goes max quickly and then decreases and eventually going zero (close to WOT). This is the basic idea. Centrifugal will only advance according to rpm, not helping out on the initial transient surge to start revving. This is the basic idea to have both working in tandem in the distributor. Great channel with really original stuff. Greets from Brazil.

Plz turn up your record volume

Your use of the term "more timing" is making it more confusing. Timing isn't something that you can have more or less of. You can have more or less time, but not timing. Maybe you could call it advanced/retarded or delayed. Or earlier/later referring to the spark timing.

Very well said Luke @ThunderHead289

Ignition timing has a lot to do with the resonant condition of maximum power. It's like a swing where you kick your legs out is like the spark. Where you advance the spark timing, there's more time to develop horsepower at higher rpms. Where you go over the top of the swing-set is like your horsepower peak. The timing of the legs kicking is just like variable ignition timing across the rpm range. Less advance at slower speeds and higher advance at high speeds. Compression ratio is the real source of all power. Ignition timing is just to fine tune all the performance that is really available out of the engine to the wheels.

If I'm not mistaken, I believe you mightve passed me on the highway one day. I was in my 77 f150 and you went and blew my doors off, haha. Awful familiar lookin blue f100. Love all these videos on carbs, ignition timing, and getting mpgs from these old school ironheads.

Outstanding explanation.

Very nice explanation, thank you. Also Skorned is so awesome thanks for introducing me to them. They scratch my 90s itch

You’re the king of carbs

Hey there Luke do you have an opinion on bbc gen 6 454 heads are vortec ? They seem to like less then 30 total timing ? But what about intial I'm a little confused with were to go after trying a few different things holley 750 dp with 544 lift 234 / on 110 lsa headers stock hei dui coil and module runing 30ish total 11 intial limited port manifold 10 deg , 4 corner idle at 3/4 turns out on all vac is around 15 hgs any suggestions would help idle response is ok no real bog but I feel it could be better thank you for your time your the man wish you lived closer !!! Thanks justin

"more timing" "pull timing"
These don't easily equate to a spark sooner or later - thus the tutorial is not very informative.

Thanks for posting. The younger generation needs more straight answers like these if they're getting into tuning. 4 out of 5 auto parts stores I've been to within the past few years had people that didn't even know what a cap and rotor was anymore.
I personally use a timing light as well as a vacuum gauge when I set my timing.
You're right about carburetors being pretty forgiving. You'll make it home, you'll just get terrible mileage until you get the tune right. That was what my car went through in high school years, haha.

I'm surprised. Here's a TIMING Comment you didn't address. And it is. I see guys over and over crank timing at idle then when they get on it they pink and blow valves. Because timing is way too high .... initial set is 10 degrees. Whether you use vacume or not. Then the weights advance with rpm. I the reason ghe weights advance with speed IS. VERY IMPORTANT. With engine speed the charge is comming in faster and the timing has to advance to keep up. That's what the weights are for. So I see guys do initial at 20degrees then Crack valves from over timing bad bad bad. Explain this to people. In a follow up timing vid

Late timing leads to hot exhaust gases which transfer a lot of heat to the cylinder head on the way out. If you get your timing late enough you can make the manifolds glow.

quite a good explanation...I once diagnosed a faulty vacuum advance by noticing that i manually had to advance my distributor to compensate the lack of advance at an idle, thus creating a dragging crank over while starting the engine...replacing the vacuum advance allowed proper timing and engine starting.

Just remember, most carburetor issues are ignition related.

Fuel grade affects where your timing is set also.
Super unleaded has burn inhibitors that make fuel slow burn through the stroke, therefore timing can be advanced quite a ways before TDC
Cheap gas “detonates” or burns instantly and needs to be retarded closer to or after TDC… (the spring in the vacuum advance does this).
Adjusting the distributor changes the range of timing… not necessarily the timing itself.
To get an honest ignition time one must not only disconnect the vacuum but also Keep your rpms low enough to not engage the centrifugal weights.
That’s why Chiltons had a recommended rpm when setting timing.
Great channel I’ve been binge watching. 👍

ThunderHead289: When you say " More timing". Do you mean more advancement or do you mean more of a range of timing?

Does the carburetor Frost up I'm just curious is ice up and essentially block itself off??

Bro it sounds like you got your doctorate in engine mechanics at the University of Space Time Continuum and you’re talking about “over simplified” like dude I didn’t understand one thing you said… I’m tryna learn something over here feeling like an idiot and you just added insult to injury talking about “over simplified”….

I really appreciate how well spoken you are Luke. Your command of the English language helps me learn what you're teaching, much more efficiently than if you propagated the "uneducated mechanic" stereotype.

I concur, putting holes in our pistons is quite unsavory. Lol

Ive always had luck tuning carbs , been doing it for a very long time... i never over advance carb motors, they tend to diesel when you turn them off...so by pulling a little timing, you can increase torque, while keeping your car from dieseling. Im talking about tuning an engine with low compression, naturally aspirated, .
I agree with you, I think the proper way to time an engine is to indicate the crank, start with a baseline and listen to your machine, drive it, learn .

Yes, absolutely correct information, guy! And I would like to thank you for the videos too! You're da best! ¡Sí, información absolutamente correcta, guyo! ¡Y me gustaría agradecerte por los videos también! ¡Eres lo mejor!

IT DON'T GET ANY CLEARER THAN THAT FOLKS!

wish i had you around to tune my harley for me

How would octane numbers affect advance timing?
My car has a 9:1 compression ratio and was designed for 85 octanes,in my country 95 is the lowest value,and it seems that raising advance from 5 to 15 degrees has a better alround efficiency and performance.
Am I wrong?
Also what should the highest value compression ratio be at 95 octanes and still be safe for the engine?its a non turbo carburetted engine.

So I have a 302 in my truck with a pertronix retrofit unit. It tachs up and idles great, until it's under load. You can put it in gear and it will idle down the road, but as soon as you give it gas it will buck and stutter and seem like it's missing. I pulled a spark plug and it was beige. Have any clue as to what it may be. I have 12v at the pertronix, and a fresh holley 650.

Good stuff👍

I'm not sure why your discussion of centrifugal or mechanical ignition timing advance was so brief considering how important to performance of the engine it is to have it set properly. So often on YT I see people grabbing the distributor and turning it to adjust the timing and how incorrect that is. Idle speed must be set to specification before timing is adjusted. This is because idle speed assures the centrifugal advance is at its set position. If the idle is too low or too high the correct timing settings can not be made. The proper way to adjust timing is to work between a timing light and a tach assuring the timing is set at the correct idle speed.

One of the best explanations I’ve ever heard. Play it twice or three times to verify you catched everything but now a lot of stuff makes perfect sense. Thank you.

Hey Luke di you have any of those 4 barrel carb spacers left. You made them to block off an egr hole in a stock intake. If so I need one. Let me know