Is Mythic Plus Too Hard? Why Keys Are Failing in The War Within

I think they just need to go back to the season 3/4 of DF for were crest an gear tracks drop at only other thing I can think of is remove challengers peril from keys below 10

On another note why are we still using a key system when delves got a great UI/system why can’t we have a system like that for mythic plus an get rid of this depletion BS

All I can say is this is the season that is making my friends who I have done keys with since Early SL, think about quitting this season. The CC changes blows and just makes me feel like an actual kick bot. The tank changes make it harder to find tanks in a season people are already gun shy about tanking due to the dungeons being overly sweaty and brutal. And the new affixes are more annoying than feeling rewarding to deal with. Honestly I feel like this season was made by a completely different team than DF and SL. The season isn't fun. The gear grind blows. The crest system is just drip feeding you weekly and gate keeping you if your not a Mythic raider. It sucks.
This week I was finally able to craft a 636 wpn. And it's right back to grinding 9's to pump up my ilvl to get invites to 10s. Because even at 622 apparently I am still too low geared for pugs. Even though I know that I blast 10's easily with what I got. I simply can't beat the other applicant's in ilvl to impress key holders. This season is NOT the banger we all hoped for.

your video just spawned in my feed, i've been seeing A LOT of videos saying the exact same thing those past 2 weeks. tbh, here's my pov on the question (i'm not an ultra HC player, but at least in the top 1% in MM+), long story short :
- The difficulty range is not sparse enought, to many people are at the same progression state (it should really scale more up to 15).
- The 12 affix is just a joke
- The 7 affix is hard but ... is the school of life : dont die = do dmgs = time key => just learn it the hard way (ho maybe I should have used my def cd BEFORE beeing at 10% hp)
- Puging is hard because the difficulty peak is much more lower, i now see people in my keys that i should have never seen in the past (due to scaling), and those people do not really understand how the MM+ is supposed to be played, i mean : how you manage ur def cds, when and where, what u should kick (again when and where), should i release ? should i just wipe fast ? do i know the common strat ? do i know the route ? do i know the mech in a more general way ? Many people reach the cap of 9-10 and have no clue of all of that : MM+ is 90% not about your output (in term of dps or hps), but this is those 90% well played who give you the opportunity to, indeed, output :)
- In accord with the difficult scaling getting gilded at 9 is not a problem, but the difficulty should scale more after, anyway i'm really in favor of getting rewarded because you accomplished something, i see no prob at all with the current reward system, people just want gear without doing anything ... i personnaly had no problem to gear up (except with the vault rng) and most of my friend also had no problems at all (i do not have a guilde for raids if that matter)
- Finally I aggree the dungeons are currently really unforgiving, small mistakes lead in instant death, affixes are punishing etc, also the current mechs in dungeons are polirazing the comps (rsham everywhere just because of how ez it is to output while also bringing the most utility of all healers and the best dispells), same for war and drood tank due to their capacity to face tank white hits and endure hard damage spikes
Anyway many people are complaining way to much, this is one of the best MM+ season i've seen so far, yes it is punishing, but you kinda feel a bit rewarded in the end

The timers are way too hard. 1 fail is a deplete

Short answer - no, it's not. It's the primary game mode which is catered to 90% of the player base. Therefore, it's far more accessible and projected than the other game mode (pvp).

Some 10 were a bit hard to timed the first week with less than 610 ilvl, but now with gear and nerf they are all super easy. I have 2k7 score on my main and 2k6 on my alt while I am just pugging to fill vault. I don't know while you have to talk about score getting to easy to get and talking about 1000 score ? 1000 or 2000 is noob player like always. And you have both tyrannical and fortified in every 10+ key so your comments are false.

In your upgrade track/crest charts you need to replace the word "Harbinger" with "Runed".

If you have a full 5 man team then its ok, if you pug this season is awful thats it in a nutshell, pugging this season is a extreamly unpleasant way of playing as these keys require alot more co ordination. Where if one player makes a mistake it is more punishing. And pugs naturally are going to have more mistakes. The people who have a set team and can do 9s all the time have access to better gear from myth track where the vast majorty of players now cant get that gear which means there is a bottle neck of olayers who cant improve there gear to make the key easier

"having only 2 key levels awarding mythic crests is horrible and we all agree on this" no we dont all agree on this. It is health. A +9 is much easier than the last two HC bosses or Mythic bosses. Mythic+ is much more interesting this way than before. Last expansions we used to get all portals by week 4 and just quit the game. Now its much harder and its fun. However, the jump from a +9 to a +10 is too big. what @siliur24 said is right. But they should give tanks and healers more benefits to make the roles attractive. This way pugging will be better. Stop getting on this train of crying and making videos for clicks.

Basically, keys are depleted because DPS players suck. They don't want to interrupt casts, CC mobs, or use defensive cooldowns. The only thing they can do is compete with each other in DPS while standing in pools of fire and poison.

Nah

For me, the rewards are not commensurate with the effort required, so i just dont do them

nothing like pugging 9s and 10s and everyone gives up after 1 wipe even if we are ahead of timers cause the death affix sucks. blizz is programming us to eb perfect and if we make a mistake people are acting like the key is dead

No, m+ keys are not too hard. People are bad. Crests sucks, upgrading gear sucks. Bring back BfA system

I don't know, sure I'am not the average oe on wow but I am not that good either and I was doing 9s with low ivl first week and had no issue doing 11s second week in pugs. Until 12s the timers are not tight getting ilvl is not the issue.

The biggest issue is the 15 second death penalty. It is toxic and anti fun

to me all the problems arise around the 9 to 10 level, 7 in a way also because of the death affix even one bad player can make u not time the key which wasnt possible in the past unless you were above a 22 .

I would love to do more keys myself, but as a DPS whos all friends have stopped playing WoW, getting into a group takes like 30min+ of signing to 50+ groups, just to get into a +5 key where I am doing 50% of the dps. It is just so discouraging.

Theres also one problem that sucks: meta classes. I play Unholy DK and I'm not saying UH is bad at the moment or anything. But I'm always getting declined because I'm not playing frost... Right now, I'm sitting at 622ilv and 2300io which I got with guild members, not with pugs. I spend like 20-30 minutes in queue looking for a +9 to do, always using the pylon that halts your flask duration in between m+ because I'm just wasting time there. The final crests being looked behind 9s and not 8s is crap. My experience with pugs (pugs only) is that is way too easy to complete an 8 on time but not a 9. Blizzard promised to implement some kind of penalty for leavers but where is it? Like many people said here, you are not allowed to wipe ONCE, or maybe you pulled one extra add, and people will start crying and will just leave. And nothing will happen to them.

i can just recommend the addon global ignore list in hope that one day i have it full enough to never run into garbage again.

Well what i do when i pug around 10-12+ i always say, this gona take time before we start, first i need to know that you have not buy your scors, secound that you know your class and last how many times have you sone this dungeon

As a tank, pugging has been really really bad. Pulls frequently turn into grandmaster level, 0.5 second game of chess where I have one global to decide if I die to white swings or a DPS dies to white swings because they rip aggro, pugs and just want to pump and will regularly get mad at you for them killing themselves. I'm getting my weekly 10's but I already cancelled my sub because the message is crystal clear, if you aren't in a guild or a premade group, this content is not for you and you are not welcome. Delves while appreciated do not satisfy my cravings for 'high' difficulty content. I've tanked at the highest level of the game in raid settings and been at the cutting edge, but I no longer want to commit myself to any guild or group. Least fun tanking experience for me since shadowlands honestly.

people keep talking about the squish like it just happened, did you not play s4 or something? Like, this happened in DF. The squish is fine imo. But the gearing changes suck, the death penalty sucks, the new affixes suck. It's just in a rough state rn

Isnt hard, u are doing delves like a great hero and think DGs is same

Thanks for sharing your opinion on this topic, that sub is well deserved. I'd like to add a couple of things to the mix:
1) M+ has never been intended as solo content. Its premade group content with the possibility to pug it to a certain degree. The main reason M+ was introduced was to give smaller ambitioned groups an alternative to mythic raid progression.
2) This expansion is as friendly as it gets with gearing, especially for casuals. Delve rewards are seriously overtuned considering how much of a 'challenge' they present. Heroic items for solo content, like wth?
3) Mythic crests being locked behind 9+ keys is absolutely fine to me, since the 6+ requirement from Dragonflight was a complete joke. You dont need 636 crafts or ilvl 623+ stuff to get the +10 keys timed. You just need to be a decent m+ player. Decent in terms of playing your class properly, using your kit and avoiding faildamage, thats it. If we're lowering the requirements and therefore outgear the content, all it will do lower the average skill level of the people you meet in your pug experience, doesnt sound that helpful if you already think that the content is tough.
4) I think the biggest issue within the M+ reward system is player entitlement. M+ has always been an easy source for the highest gear and people took it for granted. So did you. Both the +6 a dragonflight key required to get top tier crests and +8 to get the mythic track vault were ridiculously easy in comparison to mythic raiding or highranked pvp. Raising the bar on M+ keys was a very important first step to emancipate a meaningful independant gear progression for M+ purists and will potencially open the way for mythic track dungeon rewards for highkeys in future seasons.

M+ isnt to hard, there are just a lot of really bad players and now its proving that

Why would you as a devolper want to punish your own player by bring stuff like cc dont bring spells on cd or 15 sec death penalty?

Let the ppl have fun and better player will push even higher keys then. It didnt hurt anyone. Why do it like that?

In my experience, if people actually interrupted cast like they should they wouldn't die...but i guess its too big a dps loss to press their kicks and they would rather get clapped by the spell and do 0 damage and cost 15 sec instead. Can't tell you how many times i check details for interrupts and see 0 to 3 interrupts on people for the entire dungeon

nah the tank/healer balance is down right horrendous

prot pal get blasted it's like they ain't wearing armor to the point that i simply refuse to take one in my key
DH / BREW are ok but there is no mistake allowed
BDK is the probably the most average/passable of them all and yet you still can get globaled by a mist guardian tho
so far only (good) druid and war feel like they are actually 'tanky'

but it's way worse for the healer

hpal need to be played with perfect timing and good luck if you need to top up someone outside of your CD every single beacon of virtue is 'timed/scheduled' and you can't deviate at all if someone make a mistake before.
rdrood have to use 20 gcd for a mediocre healing
hpriest can't aoe heal for shit the amount of burst dmg there is
while we have rsham absolutely dunking on every healing check and mechanics this season.

it's not god comp level yet but it's approaching very freaking fast where war/rsham/aug will be the 'required' starting comp for almost every key superior to 10
tank are already in limited resource only 3 week into the season
healer a bit less because every healer can heal with a rsham right away

but i feel like this season is going to be probably the worst season in all of mythic+ history if they ain't reactive pretty freaking fast
give tank their tankyness back, remove this stupid CC/no-interrupt mechanic, fix the stupid amount of AOE wide dmg back to back to the point some healer just can't handle it without a coordinated group and rolling CD. the devour affix just need to die i ain't playing without PCT and it sucks.

No its not hard. If u do mechanics properly instead of getting that one extra hit in and dying u and your group would do way better. also it's a month in and ppl are allrdy reaching 2700 rating...

I like that we're striving for.. what did you say... "Three Six Nine" gear, in Mythic+. lawl

Yeah it kind of is, especially for a healer even if you’re a Resto shaman

It isn't, Xalacrutch makes people who should be getting filtered by 5s instead shit up 9+s, get out of my season.

Is anyone still playing this? 😂

At least they removed the annoying affixes and we finally play the dungeon and not the affix. Now they have to figure out the tunning and we gucci!

Dude you lost me when you said you think class balance is in a good state...and you are playing a warrior.

ppl are either too elitist, trolling or don’t do mechanics or kicks.

i'm failing because dps players are afk idiots.

I think the biggest problem is the rewards, compare the rewards you received in Legion or BfA vs the rewards you get now, this was bearable during Shadowlands because it was more rewarding that Thorgast (which was a torture chamber made by Blizzard) and Blizzard kept that meager reward system
The challenge is not enough incentive to go higher

yes. blizzard loves one shot mechanics

it was more fun when 15 got you the good item in vault and it was reasonably difficult

They could probably fix all their issues by making tyrannical + fortified be the +7 affix, xalaths guile be the +10 affix, and peril be the +12 affix

M+ for pugs are too hard and not fun. The worst part is how long it's taking blizz to FIX IT.

i canceled my acc over the changes from s4 into s1 and on Nov 4th ill be done. worst patch, worst event, worst raid, worst tuning , class changes.... the list keeps going. Ion should be replaced for his role in the current state of the game.

The problem for them is ideological. They saw mythic plus growing like it did and instead of saying, we’re doing something really good here, they saw too many bad players getting the best gear and decided that that meant they’re not properly segregating everybody according to their skill level. so they squished a bunch of people out of mythic plus altogether and just progressively made it harder and harder and harder to get mythic track gear

Not realizing that people were getting their mythic track gear and still pushing and mythic plus was still growing .

Unless this discord server permanently bands, anyone whoever says anything negative at any time, I and most players are simply not gonna be interested.

I just wanna be able to get best in slot without being a burden on you. I just wanna do it on my own pace in my own way just let delves scale up please they’re fucking boring and stupid but at least I can just do them on my own and I’m not a burden on you and you’re not a burden on me and nobody ever has to yell at anybody because this is a fucking video game .

Gear progression is so bad.....the fact that you need to invest myth crest to upgrade heroic gear and that if you want to upgrade somethign from vault u will have no crest to upgrade things you might drop from raid is ridicolous. as a tank who is currently 8/8 i never had such worst situation of not getting loot from raid for obvius reasons and not ebing able to get it elsewhere......and this made BoE items having a stupid immense value and being kinda mendatory for crest economy

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