The case against Universal Basic Income (UBI)

As for governments, they can do whatever they want anyway, even our own, so that's no argument against. My worry is how the economics react; simple inflation comes to mind so that that payment amount is weakened and employers are tempted to pay workers less because of the extra support. All of which negates the value of UBI. Still, I'd like to give it a try to see what happens. In a way the same support can happen simply by taxing the hell out of the rich (as high as 90% like in the last century) and giving qualifying people a level of cash equal to a given basic income for the area they are in. That, of course requires a lot of administration while just giving everyone the same amount is simple, removing all bureaucracy. But that's not entirely fair; people in New York City and in rural south Georgia have extremely different economics to deal with. $1,000 in NYC is pocket change while $1,000 in south Georgia is a huge boost. You need administration to determine how to iron that out.

I hope they do this. Then I can finally pay off all this dept I was forced to accumulate just to function in society. It will make my job easier, and I can finally invest in my future. Just do it. Do something. Anything to fix the problems. Don't do absolutely nothing. We have to at least test out different ideas to see what works for the progressive future.

You cant trust governments for anything if we have mostly automated world what are the people supposed to do crime is bad enuf now can you imagine if employment rate sky rockets the very little honest people will conform the rest will rebell and possibly overturn governments and clause Schwab either way will be sad state of affairs from these theives

In the US it is the Media wing of the Democratic Party that will cancel you if you speak out against the Government's actions.

Never work again? I'm not sure about you , but $1200 a month cannot even pay my rent. This is such bullshit.

It is UNIVERSAL basic income. Everyone gets the same amount. Government taking it back or using it to control people goes against the main principle of the policy.

It would give freedom back to a large number of people currently trapped on welfare. Afraid to go into the job market for fear of losing their welfare.

Please stop fear mongering and pushing the narrative that money "could" be used as a weapon against the poor. It alredy is. UBI would be an end to that.

What you describe isn't UBI. A universal basic income should come with no strings attached. But of course, that governments would attach strings does seem likely. But then it's not a real UBI.

I don't see any real alternatives to UBI being offered as alternatives. If 50% of jobs disappear, what happens to the people that don't have a job? If they wont be able to cover their basic needs, there will be revolution.

But I'm not so sure we'll get there. Automation is happening, and I don't see a way to stop that. But so far, humanity has been very good at creating new jobs. And lately we've become very good at creating jobs that aren't really needed - bullshit jobs. That might expand even more. I will not be surprised if in the future, the vast majority of jobs are completely unnecessary. And that would then, in practice, be the string. We'll sort of have a UBI, except we need to work for it. Even if the work has no apparent purpose. But it does have a purpose - and that is to prevent civil unrest.

Or we could just have a real UBI. But I think the biggest roadblock to UBI is that some people just don't like the idea of people getting money for free.

I agree with you wholeheartedly! I shared this on Facebook! 😘

I am on the left and this UBI just sounds so dangerous.. people really don’t realize that giving everybody a guaranteed income is basically just lowering the value of the dollar.. I don’t know how this isn’t clear to everyone regardless of political affiliation?? Sure I got my $1000 a month check but my rent now in rural Alabama is the same as what NYC’s rent used to be before UBI.. and NYC rent is now $10000 a month for a flat. People are so easily fooled by the dangled carrot in front of them they don’t see the rich taking off with what little capital we have left.

You called Forbes a credible source? 😅

UBI should be paid for by a Robotics Tax derived from displaced workers by robots.

Chattering classes: "Artificial Intelligence will destroy everyone's employment. So we need a UBI by next Thursday at the latest!"

Also chattering classes: "There's a terrible labour shortage. So we need to import truckloads of Third World immigrants by next Wednesday at the latest!"

Well, which is it? Because they can't both be true.

Thats why Bitcoin has been invented. Decentralized network of thousands of nodes that can be and are run by individuals. Protected by highest hash power on the planet. Trustless network, no need for any kind of permission to transact. Which is an absolute necessity for freedom. Especially in coming years.

Regarding the government taking away UBI as a means of control, they already can freeze assets and bank accounts which has the same effect.

If so many people are afraid of government why do we have governments? They make laws anyway so they have control. We have government exactly for that, for control. You should protest no matter of UBI each day every day then. 🤷

You bring to light realistic concerns, but they have little to do with UBI.

In today's world of ubiquitous cameras, you can't really hide much of anything. But that's true with or without a UBI.

The concern that you'd only be allowed to spend the money on government-approved goods and services is not far-fetched (there are UBI experiments in South Korea where the money must be spent locally, so no McDonald's or Amazon). But that's something which would need to be hammered out before the program began.
Also, that's what we do NOW in the US and most of the world. If you get SNAP (food stamps), you have to spend it on food. So, if you're good at finding bargains and using coupons, so you have $30 of SNAP left over at the end of the month, but you can't afford $25 worth of school supplies, well too bad. If you have a housing voucher, you can only spend it on housing. MedicAid doesn't buy laundry soap. And so on.

As for "the government could take your UBI away if you say or do something they don't like," well come on: they can fine you or jail you now. The government doesn't need UBI to exercise control.

With or without UBI, the price of liberty remains eternal vigilance.

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What you do in that case is to go to a friend and say, "I'll buy you $30 worth of groceries, if you'll give me $25 cash so I can buy my kids some school supplies." So, there are ways around.

I got to say there are a lot of well researched and tested and documented cases for supporting UBI and all I see here in your video is your feelings being presented as facts and your hyperbole being presented as research you have no credentials listed to even make this argument in the first place

Revolution 13 :16-17 the mark of the beast. It's in the Bible. Read it

The down side is you have to get the mark of the beast, and pledge your aleagance to Satan.

Re. the paragrapgh brought up in your concerns section; I hate to break it to you, but if you own a smartphone, this is already a thing.
The control you speak of has been tried in Australia through Centrelink payments to jobseekers a few years ago. Remember the robodebt fiasco of the early 2010s. It simply doesn't work in liberal democracies, or any society that values freedom. Restrictions on government control over citizens will always be balanced by such acts as The Bill of Rights like we have in ACT, Queensland and Victoria. As synthetic control rises, so must libertarian laws be upheld & improved to prevent civil unrest & wars.
The real problem is the sociopathic individuals that horde vast sums of money, simply to keep score & keep others from having infuence in society. This will be particularly problematic in countries like the USA, Russia & China where business has tight control over legislation. Corruption & greed are always the anthropomorphic causes of the downfall of civilisations. We have already seen the collapse of Communism & Socialism. Capitalism is next, & it is because of the technical progress you speak of & even more developments that you haven't. What comes after that? Digitalism? Cyberism?
UBI is going to happen. There is simply no other workable solution, so long as we rely on currency based trade.
The good news is that human contentment has never relied on government. It's always up to us.

Oxygen.

it is NOT going to happend . atleast not as people espect .

This is said by someone who is rich you realise that you on a diffrent scale of success right

If a black community trusted someon to cook for the whole block and gave them a fiver to feed the community right now but we still do not do that so the problem is are self focused view that we are more important than someone else and you somehow think freedom still exists when the thing that you call money and value of it is the thing that controlls you cause of the thought that you own it

The effort you put in put an idea of ownership on the money and that feeling is controlled by you right to denie someone beacause it be valued by you individual effort so it more than on doller so you created a way of control

Reverse the argument:
A robot plants, waters, grows, harvests, processes, packages, and mails all food.

So, food becomes free.

Put it another way:
Suppose there is suddenly 100 million people instead of 8 billion.

But there are 1 billion homes, 1 billion iPhones, etc, etc.

The problem then becomes:
What do we do with our free time?

Get drunk and stoned and fu ck!

UBI brings happiness.
THAT is the single most important reason to do it.

Divorce rates would probably fall, most are financial fights.
France is dumping a 1/4 billion of wine into the ocean.
Free bacon is running rampant all over Texas.
More than 50% of all government administrator jobs would disappear, lowering taxes for the rest of us.
50% of all food is thrown away.
If we could lower the childhood obesity rate of 1 in 3 to say even 1 in 5, healthcare and food costs would plummet.

I am not following this argument:
Automation leads to job loss leads to no way to pay bills.
But doesn't automation simply mean that costs would plummet?
If automation can transport wine, bacon, and wheat to anyone, we would experience massive price drops in all goods.

USA cost:
$3.1 trillion

But:
Reduce that need by $1 trillion because 70 million people already receive Social Security

Then, eliminate all welfare programs that require administration salaries, like SNAP.
Probably save another $1 trillion.

Then, how much do we spend on the homeless and crime just because people have no money each month? Add in prison costs which we would not need so much.

Then, much if not most of the money gets put back into the economy, i.e. people would spend it.

Landlords would be made whole.

I do not see a downside at all.

And the single most important thing on earth this would bring is:
HAPPINESS

Ask 99 people who need it: YES!
Ask the 1 person who doesn't need it: NO!

Guess who's vote counts?

Who financed this? Because it's just fear mongering bollocks.

George Orwell coming true

No thanks I like all the money I have and retired with all things paid off and millions to spend 😂

If everyone was given the same amount of free money, that free money would become worthless. Only a low IQ progressive Democrat would think that the purchasing power of that money would remain constant. If everyone was given $1 million for free, that means that $1 million becomes the new "poor class" where a loaf of bread costs $50,000. And you know only the low IQ retards would want this, which is why Democrats keep pitching "free everything" from welfare, UBI, free healthcare, free tuition, free housing, free student debt forgiveness. As if money grows on trees and nobody needs to work for anything.

It was people like you who monopolised on everything chasing money not knowing that it was designed for you people to do this so you create super inflation which is coming soon.
The sad fact is that the masses are to blame for there consumerism and wasteful nature and greedy tendencies that the elite decided needed controlling and have used you willing fools to create a system of living in equilibrium instead of the consumer society we live.many will suffer in the change over from this society to the next.harsh reality is that we are to blame for relinquishing our duty and responsibility in many ways.we are to blame for allowing our self to be tricked by the elite but for most we are to blame for becoming a selfish wasteful consumer society

She is using a article "from the future". That says all you need to know about the credibility an intent of this video.

These guys a mad and act like nazy officers . Their future will be the same.

Live off the land

These same technocrats that want to solve the problem with AI had created the problem of the AI in the first place.
They create the problem and then the solution that goes along with their agenda.
Same goes for the overpopulation myth, the covid plandemic, the global warming nonsense, and so forth.
With this they got more taxes out of people, more control of people's information, and better results at people's behavior with the covid plandemic's measures.

My grandad always said good manners and conversation are free. So at least we will still have that.

It's goodbye to freedom anyway. In a society where most jobs are done by artificial intelligence there will be no freedom to begin with, UBI has nothing to do with it. First of all, there will be 4-5 large private corporations controlling the most powerful AI, just like they control the internet now and collect all our data. Now they've trained their AI on that data. They will be the richest and most powerful ones, even more powerful than the governments. You won't be able to do anything without being tracked by AI. Our cell phones are already tracking our movements, but in the near future it will increase a hundred times. Robots will be watching us everywhere and will know everything about us - not just our movements and our bank accounts, but also our thoughts (they can already read human thoughts from brain activity quite accurately) and even our dreams. You won't be able to hide ANYTHING from them.

So... Compared to all that, UBI will be a very tiny and insignificant issue. Welcome to the future.

this old man dont life long whats the purpose he wil lose everthing AI is like climaat dont give a shit about human men

There is no against UBI. Ai automation is here and UBI and digital currency coming very soon

What a weird world view you have and live in... all these threats you allude to.. govts can just do that without UBI. If govts are these evil Starwars Empire like entities you make them out to be, they'll just keep going their evil stuff, apparently, with or without the UBI.

Please cover up

That 2016 Forbes article is a blog post by a member of the Global Future Council on Cities and Urbanization of the World Economic Forum against UBI. So you are promoting the WEF line?
As an australian welfare recipient I can tell you that you they would never tell you how to vote, and that the "restriction on what food you can buy" is only alcohol and cigarettes as requested by the aboriginal councils on who the system was first tested on. If you want to hurt yourself and have society pay for it then you have to pay tax for that right.
This post is nonsense on stilts. There are much better reasons to protest a UBI than lazy conspiracy theory. Open source E2EE comms instead of surveillance capitalism. GPS open maps and AI on the edge etc

Anyone who claims "nothing is free" should look into the history of the Commons or how the share to labour has gone down for decades.

Artificial intelligence and automation is the enemy of the human race and everything we have worked for. We must stop it at every chance we have. Please I urge people to wake up.

Like in "I, Robot", everyone had a personalised robot. Who's to bet that some people used those robots to work for others, who then paid the owner? UBI is a redivulous government control plan, but personalised work robots aren't.

We already live in the oligarchy system and control system with jobs! The Solution to the problems would be to tie UBI to GDP at 30% of the GDP and that would be the solution to any problems! Our government can do any budget they want for whatever they want and give money to corporations for trickle down which does not which since they do stock buybacks with that!